Salary negotiation is an unsettling topic for many people. One of the reasons it is so intimidating is that there are many alternative tactics you can use, to gain an upper hand. Knowing what to say and which strategies to use can maximize a salary offer from an employer. In this episode, you will learn how to negotiate salary and why it is important for career growth.
Your salary is a fundamental aspect of your job and knowing how to negotiate salary influences your career success. Negotiating your starting pay and asking for raises are critical factors in choosing to accept a position and feeling valued in your job. Our host Porschia, and guest, Brandon Bramley, further discuss the importance of salary negotiation and share their useful insights.
Brandon Bramley is the Founder of The Salary Negotiator. He has a background in strategic negotiations from working in many professional negotiation roles at large companies, including Amazon and American Airlines. With over a decade of excellence in negotiating multi-million dollar deals, Brandon, leads The Salary Negotiator, where he provides professional job offer and salary negotiation coaching.
What you’ll learn:
- The common mistakes people make, when trying to negotiate salary
- Why salary negotiation is important and what are the essential steps of salary negotiation
- When is the right time to share your salary expectations and who are the right people to share them with
- Why you should not get fixated on one number and why you should keep your offer open ended
- Some of the challenges that executives and professionals face with salary negotiations and how to tackle them
As a thank you for listening to this episode of the Career 101 Podcast, we are sharing our FREE master class – Career 911: Solving the Top 5 Challenges Executives and Professionals Have! It’s a training based on solving the common problems our clients have experienced to reach their goals. You can get access to the master class here!
Episode Transcript
Porschia: [00:00:00] Today, we are talking about salary negotiation 101, how to negotiate salary with Brandon Bramley. Brandon Bramley is the founder of the salary negotiator. He has a background in strategic negotiations from working in many professional negotiation roles at large companies, including Amazon and American Airlines.
where he’s not only led multi million dollar B2B negotiations, but also recruited and hired many professionals. He has over 10 years of experience in negotiating salaries and leads the salary negotiator, where he provides professional job offer and salary negotiation coaching to help navigate the negotiation process.
And earn higher compensation. He’s coached clients through [00:01:00] hundreds of salary negotiations with companies ranging in size from small businesses to, uh, most of the global corporations, such as Google, Meta, Apple, and Microsoft. Very impressive, Brandon. How are you today?
Brandon: I’m doing great. Thanks, Portia.
Excited to be here on the Career 101 podcast. Perfect.
Porschia: Well, we are excited to have you with us to discuss Salary Negotiation 101. But first, we want to know a little more about you. So tell me about seven year old Brandon.
Brandon: Seven year old Brandon. Wow. What a long time ago. Um, I would say honestly, seven year old Brandon was probably doing something active outside or getting in trouble with my brother.
Um, I actually grew up in a very small town up in Northern Arizona. So I wouldn’t say outside of school and learning and some other activities. There was really much else to do rather than something active outside or [00:02:00] building something in the garage. So usually it ended up being, Oh, Cruise around the house as well as the neighborhood and then getting out on hikes and enjoying nature when we could.
Porschia: Very cool. Very cool. Yeah. Arizona is gorgeous. Uh, I’ve only been to visit and unfortunately it was daring be really hot months. Don’t know why I was there in like August, but, uh, you know, I, I was there in the heat. Um, so as you were outside, uh, exploring and maybe putting. Some things together in the garage, uh, what did you want to be when you
Brandon: grew up?
That’s a great question. Um, to be honest, I was kind of unsure what I wanted to be when I grew up. I mean, I worked, um, as like a kid starting at 16 in the restaurant industry, but I figured out. pretty quickly. That wasn’t going to cut it. Um, so I thought I actually wanted to be in biomedical engineering, go into the medical field.
But once I actually went down to school in Phoenix, um, started going through those courses, I ended up making a ton of friends that were actually swapping over to [00:03:00] business just because I ended up being a. Pretty social person. Um, so I ended up actually following suit with them to where I went into business and supply chain.
Um, and then through actually like different networking events, that’s actually where I decided on supply chain and actually network my way into getting into like a negotiations role and starting to work with external partners. Um, so I wouldn’t say I knew exactly what I wanted to do. I didn’t really have like a crystal ball.
I thought I did. And then honestly, by kind of being open to opportunities and meeting people, it led me into kind of my career, which turned into being professional negotiation roles with a few different companies. And now the salary negotiator. That
Porschia: is great. That is great. Hold on one second, Brandon.
We’re going to cut this out. My microphone switched over on me for some reason. Oh no. I don’t know
Brandon: what
to say. That’s never [00:04:00] good. No.
Yeah, which one do you use? Do you use one in your, uh.
Porschia: Yeah, I have a Yeti mic, and for some reason. It is not wanting to stay connected. I just noticed when I looked down at using my audio from the computer.
Okay, let’s see. Maybe I just need a new board I’ll have to go to Best Buy later and get it but I want to get the best sound obviously. Yeah, absolutely.
Yeah, let’s just do what we got.
Brandon: Oh, sorry. Yeah, no, take your time. I
Porschia: was crowded in the back and now it’s on. Okay. Is it
Brandon: working? Because I can, I can hear you perfectly. So. Yes.[00:05:00]
Porschia: It’s just not showing up on the monitor. It’s so
weird. It’s showing. It’s not, it’s not showing.
Brandon: Yeah, that’s right. I always say technical issues. It’s a
Porschia: pain. This is the first time this has ever happened to me.
Brandon: Uh, I don’t know. Do you want to try calling back in to see if it reconnects or? No,
Porschia: because I don’t want to, I don’t want to stop the recording.
Yeah. And then just have to start all over because I think it was really great and natural. Uh, What I might do is just pull this a little closer to me to make sure that we can get my audio to be really good. It’s weird because it’s showing that it’s [00:06:00] on and it’s connected. It’s just not registering in my, um, Zoom for some reason.
It’s weird. Yeah, very weird. Weird, weird. Okay. Well, of course, when I did that, now it came on. Oh,
Brandon: nice. Yeah. You sound way better now.
Porschia: Okay. So you can tell. Yeah. So
Brandon: glad I got it
Porschia: back. Yes. Okay. So Yeti is back with us. Okay. So I will have to tell Muhammad to do some editing. It was probably somewhere like four to six and then I’m like, okay,
well,
okay. Sorry about the technical difficulties.
So Brandon, tell us about some highlights or [00:07:00] pivotal moments in your career before you started your business.
Brandon: Yeah, actually. So before I started my business, I would say kind of one of the biggest pivotal moments that actually ended up being the reason of why I started it, um, was actually in one of my negotiation classes in my last semester of college.
Um, so I actually just received a job offer with American airlines. Um, so as an undergrad, um, not a lot of work experience other than a few internships. And I essentially got a job offer in procurement with American airlines where my core role was going to be business to business negotiations. So I wanted to make sure I’m
Um, and then like my side goal was to turn it into my negotiations professor. They turned it up as my year end project. Um, so I did go through the negotiation and it was actually pretty successful. So as an undergrad, I was able to get a base increase, um, a sign on bonus. And one of the craziest things that I.
Still haven’t seen yet in any of our negotiations was actually a bunch of airline miles before I [00:08:00] even started with America Airlines that ended up actually paying for a trip to Ecuador for 3 weeks before I started. Um, so with that, I turned it into my professor, did the full write up, turned it in, and I actually found out.
Um, another student got a job offer at the American Airlines as well. Um, so she actually put me in touch with him to go ahead and help him negotiate his offer. Um, so I helped him through the process and kind of what I did and it ended up being successful as well. So, but the odd thing was, uh, we ended up becoming good friends, but once we started at American Airlines, it was a whole cohort of professional negotiators, but no one actually negotiated their job offers.
Which I thought was crazy. They all thought they didn’t have experience. They didn’t have leverage yet. They were just an undergrad. Uh, but my buddy and I did, and we ended up with unfortunately better packages, um, with us. So that was kind of a pivotal moment to where I was like, wow, this is a really thing.
And it also started getting my kind of name out there. So I started helping friends, helping other colleagues like over the years, actually helping them negotiate their salaries as they started to part American [00:09:00] Airlines.
Porschia: Wow. Wow. So the negotiators did not negotiate before they got the role. And what that tells me about you, Brandon, is that you’re very confident because I think, and I’m sure you see this with your clients as well, but I think that that underlying degree of confidence is what allows you to go in there and, you know, ask for what you would like or ask for what you are dreaming of.
Right. And see if they say
Brandon: yes. Yeah, absolutely. I mean, I definitely back then, I would say this is confident. I was pretty terrified at being my first big job out of college. Um, but after doing that and seeing it work and then seeing it work with a friend as well, as well as other colleagues that greatly boosted my confidence.
Um, just because with anything in life, you don’t really build up confidence until you do it at least once. Um, and usually if you get like good success, otherwise, if it goes bad, it’s not always the best confidence booster. Yeah. Um, and it’s, when it comes to negotiations, [00:10:00] especially salary negotiations, it’s not something you do every day.
It also pushes you out of your comfort zone. At least it did me to go ahead and negotiate your behalf. It’s not just kind of business to business. Now the stake on the line is the job. Um, also kind of advocating for yourself. Um, so I did eventually actually build up that confidence over the years of doing it and that experience.
Um, but I still feel that a lot of people kind of fight with that as in not having confidence to have those conversations. Um, which is kind of where we try to help as well as I’m starting to hear more and more that people are doing it. So I’m glad that people are starting to negotiate, kind of take that confidence.
Um, and then hopefully if they take the right strategies at the end of the day, the worst that company says is no, at least they built up confidence trying and kind of building that practice going forward. Yeah,
Porschia: yeah, absolutely. Um, so what have been some of your biggest career challenges before you started your business?
Brandon: [00:11:00] Yeah. Um, probably the biggest career challenge I faced, um, early in my career was I was with American Airlines for about five or six years, um, and I was super comfortable in my job. You know, I felt like I was an expert in my department and close relationships throughout the company. So I knew who to talk to, how to get my job done.
Um, so really my biggest kind of thought and challenge was like, I do want to make a change. I want to continue growing my skills, but I was terrified to make that jump. Um, so actually leaving kind of. To a new company was terrifying for me, but what ended up happening is I interviewed with a few companies.
I ended up kind of going through that process and I finally took that leap to try something new. And at the moment it was like a big challenge because I was scared to say goodbye to all those relationships. I was also at American airlines, give up free flights, which most people still think is crazy as well.
But, um, what ended up happening is once I actually started, um, at Amazon, kind of the new company I moved to the first. months. Yes, they were a little, a little [00:12:00] turbulent, a little tough as I started to like learn new, build up that network, find out kind of what I actually do. Um, but looking back on that, the skills I learned from making that change, um, as well as getting into a new industry and kind of developing my career was worthwhile.
But at the moment, I think I ended up staying at American Airlines probably longer than I would have if I didn’t know it was so easy to make that transition and try something new. And then if something actually went wrong, I could just pivot back or pivot to something else.
Porschia: Yeah. Yeah. And I hear that a lot from clients who are, you know, perhaps a little apprehensive to make a change.
And I really liked the positive spin that you put on it because, uh, that’s something I try to share with people too, right? If, if something doesn’t work, you can pivot back to it, uh, for our clients who are starting businesses. I mean, You can always go back and get a job at some point in time, right? And so sometimes just knowing that can really help someone to kind of move [00:13:00] forward and try something new.
Brandon: Yeah, it really can because even so one of the experiences in my early career, I actually tried leaving American Airlines once before Amazon to go to a larger bank. Um. And I ended up only working there for six months. I built their vendor management procurement department, but it honestly was not the right fit.
I was not happy with it. It was a huge change. I was like, Oh, I messed up. I don’t know what I was doing, but what ended up happening is I was able to actually pivot back to American airlines after six months, um, keep the relationship with the bank, um, rekindle relationships with American airlines and actually negotiate a raise in a better position coming back.
Um, so. It does happen. It’s obviously tough and a little bit stressful at the time. Um, but yeah, the opportunities are open. And then I ended up getting kind of poached by Amazon six months later, which I would have never thought would have happened.
Porschia: Yeah. And in what you’re sharing just then and what I’ve heard you mentioned earlier, and I think you’ll probably get deeper into this as we go forward, but I’m hearing you say the word [00:14:00] relationships quite a bit.
And I think A lot of times people don’t consider relationships, um, you know, throughout their career and with salary negotiation as well. They just kind of think everything’s cut and dry and just like this situation or the circumstances in isolation, you know, by itself, they don’t see the big picture of the relationship.
So, um, thank you for pointing that out. Of course.
Brandon: Yeah. Cause I mean, even kind of the way I coach negotiation, at least the way I interact with negotiation is it’s always the tone of almost like you’re talking with a friend and having that relationship rather than that old school technique that most people think negotiation is.
Maybe what you experienced, say it’s like the car dealership where they throw out a high number, you throw out a low number, you argue until you meet in the middle. Um, most negotiations go a lot better. If you build that relationship, um, you talk to someone like the
Point and use a few tactics to kind of guide yourself through that.
Porschia: Yeah. Yeah. [00:15:00] So, uh, we can tell that you were doing a lot of this negotiation throughout your career. Um, but what made you want to actually start your own business? Yeah.
Brandon: So I’d say honestly, the, the defining part of like starting my own business is I always had in the back of my mind, um, just because my dad was a business owner and he showed flexibility with work.
I’m taking time off when he could, um, and just really enjoying what he did with some of the relationships that he built. So I always had that in my back mind that I wanted to do that. But I also really enjoyed, um, kind of working in professional negotiations, procurement and vendor management roles and the companies I was with.
So luckily enough for me, it was a little unplanned where I started the salary negotiator, um, a little over five years ago as a side business, just because what ended up happening is as people left some of these companies I worked with, um, they would come to me to help them negotiate their salary. Then it ended up being like.
Their friends, their colleagues, and the pool kept getting bigger until it’s like, you know, and I’m just [00:16:00] going to offer this as a professional services, um, as a side business. And that actually blossomed in tandem with my work. Um, so once I started doing that and I was looking at, okay, staying with, um, Amazon at the time or doing kind of my side business, um, I did love negotiations, but what I noticed is it was a lot more rewarding actually working with people and seeing them get these like big life changes, um, and like a tangible change for them rather than some of these.
Big business to business negotiations that I would work at that were sometimes as big as they were in the multiple millions. Um, we’re just like a toss in the bucket for a big company. Um, so that’s kind of what was the defining moment is as it continued to true, true guests and actually turned out of a side business and kind of blossom as well as my interest started to change after I was further in my career, I’m like, what’s important to me?
What makes me happy?
Porschia: Yeah. Yeah. Whoa. You said a lot of, a lot of great things right there that I, I hope everyone caught. Uh, this might be an episode for [00:17:00] people to go back and listen to twice. Um, so Brandon, from your perspective, why do you think salary negotiation is so
Brandon: important? Yeah, I mean, to, to be honest, um, I think salary negotiation is most important, especially, um, speaking of like the job offer negotiation.
So when you get a new job offer, um, is because that’s when everyone’s going to have the most leverage when they actually conduct a salary negotiation, otherwise really getting that chance again, once they start is going to be a little bit of an uphill battle. Um, so it’s really the first defining moment.
The other thing too is, yeah. If you actually kind of go through the job offer negotiation and you do well and you do raise some of your recurring income, um, that’s not just going to set you up for the next year. That’s going to set you up for your career earnings and that projectory. Um, and it’s going to continue to compound when you get raises, um, when you get other promotions.
And then actually when you job hop, you’re going to negotiate again and it’s going to continue to build making sure that you’re like the top end of the pay range [00:18:00] rather than just accepting kind of the first offer that’s out there.
Porschia: Yeah. Yeah. Um, I have to talk to a lot of our clients about leverage as well.
And I have shared the same thing that you mentioned about having the most leverage when you start a new job and why it’s so important to focus on the position that you want. And Sometimes that means and everyone’s situation is different, but I see a lot of clients say, well, I just want to come in at the bottom and I don’t mind working my way up and that’s admirable, but I think that we have to look at the, the situation from the big picture.
Right? And do you really need to go in at the bottom? Uh, you know, within a company, what You know, how many degrees are there to your career change, right? And so that’s something that we talk to people about, like, you know, how drastic is this career change? But a lot of [00:19:00] times I think most people don’t actually have to start at the bottom and they don’t realize that if they do from a salary perspective, but then also when I tell them from a a to a title or a role perspective, depending on where they wanna eventually end up in a corporation, um, or a company starting at the bottom.
Is not always the best way to go. So I’m glad you echoed that as well. Um, and then something else that you touched on that I thought was really interesting. We, um, had an episode on business negotiation not too long ago with a, uh, business attorney who, uh, does a lot of contracts and agreements. And she said.
Similar to what you mentioned was that, you know, she, when she came out of, um, law school, you know, it was a recession and, um, she always. Felt like she needed to change jobs to kind of increase her [00:20:00] salary because she knew that over time if she didn’t do that, she was going to be behind like her other legal counterparts.
So that really speaks to what you were saying as well.
Brandon: Yeah, absolutely. I also love that podcast with Tracy. So everyone should give that one a listen. Um, but yeah, I mean, that was a big thing because really you do have the most leverage right there at the beginning. And I’ll think I tell a lot of people is it doesn’t matter how much experience you have, who you are, if you get hired as the same role as someone else.
You should get paid the same. You shouldn’t be starting at the bottom of it. You’re going to be getting the same exact projects, expecting to deliver the same results. So, if there is compensation on the table, um, because most companies do have like a low, mid, and high end of a range for each position, it’s worth asking and trying to get.
paid at the top, top end, or at least what they’re currently paying other employees.
Porschia: Great. Great. So, Brandon, in your opinion, [00:21:00] what are the essential steps to salary negotiation?
Brandon: Yeah. So I would say, um, so what kind of Differs our practices. What we ended up doing is building kind of set steps that we’ve proven through hundreds of salary negotiations.
Only what is the actual right way to go through it, as well as how would I navigate a professional like business to business negotiation and bring those together? Um, so the first step in our process and that I recommend everyone do is understanding the components of your job offer. So really looking at what the total compensation is way too often do people latch on to, Oh, what is the base salary?
Just because they’re used to getting paid that every paycheck, that’s the core component that they’re going to make, make every year in the guaranteed pay. However, that’s not actually how the company looks at it. The company is going to look at the total compensation, which is usually your base salary plus your bonuses that year, maybe equity.
If you have equity in your offer that year, um, and then sign on bonuses and some other financial [00:22:00] perks. So they’re going to look at the whole total monetary take home pay. So if you don’t understand that. Upfront on what your actual job offer looks like as well as the benefits that come along with it.
You’re not going to be set up for success to actually negotiate You might get them to say move on the sign on bonus to the base But you’re not going to see the whole picture. They could just pull from one bucket and move it to the other So it’s always key To 1st, understand the actual components of a job offer before you go into the negotiation.
The 2nd step that I highly recommend that I think a lot of people skip. They feel like they need to go ahead and throw numbers out right away and be ready on the fly for a negotiation with the recruiter when they call to give them the job offer. But that really doesn’t end up being the. The kind of way that we would recommend the second step really should be completing your due diligence on the job offer by asking strategic questions.
So very similar to in like a professional negotiation for like business to business is usually you’re going to ask a lot of questions to pull different data points and different [00:23:00] tidbits that will help you in the negotiation and make sure you understand the deal. It’s very similar to the salary negotiation.
You should be sending back a list of questions to the recruiter. Thank you. To one, get any last questions you have before you make this big career change, as well as trying to sneak in some pre negotiation questions to where maybe you compare, um, their offerings or their benefits to other companies. Why is the 401k lower than the average?
Um, why? Do you guys have any flexibility on the PTO? I noticed that it’s only three weeks instead of like unlimited, like most companies are moving to, or even if you didn’t get a sign on bonus, this could be the first chance to ask why there wasn’t one included. Um, small questions like that are going to go ahead and actually build leverage, um, up in the negotiation, kind of set the tone that their offer might not be as competitive.
And you might actually win some freebies just by asking questions before you even started actually negotiating the comp. Um, so really the second step is kind of actually slowing down doing your due diligence And then the third [00:24:00] is I know it’s out there a lot is to research compensation and know your worth But when it comes to salary negotiation another thing in this step is to really research the compensation range for the actual company.
Um, not all companies are going to pay the same for the same roles. Um, it could be different in department. It also could be different depending on where you’re located, if it’s remote, hybrid, in person. Um, so really once you get the job offer, actually doing the compensation research so you understand it both on a base salary and a total compensation basis is going to help you understand where to actually Place your counteroffer and where your current offer sits on that range and how much room movement is left, um, because the four steps actually sending a counteroffer to the recruiter.
Um, but when you do that, you want to know how much money you should put in there. You don’t want to throw out some unrealistic number. All that can do is jeopardize the relationship or kind of bring in that old school, um, split the difference negotiation strategy. But when you’re able to actually take the compensation research, present that with [00:25:00] some of the other data points that you pulled from asking some of those questions in a nice, clean counteroffer, you have a higher probability of them accepting and not jeopardize the relationship, because you know how much movement they should have on their side to make a move.
And then the final step, um, that a lot of people miss And the fifth step in our process is handling objections with the recruiter after sending the counter offer. So what to say when they said no, a lot of recruiters, um, it’s not as easy as just sending an email or having a phone call. Usually when people ask, um, for increases on the job offer, most recruiters are trained to say no and use a few different tactics.
So actually knowing the ways to overcome that, to ensure they actually take it back to the decision makers to get you a better increase. I love it.
Porschia: I love it. I was taking some notes. Some really great things. Um, I’ll piggyback on some of the, the areas that I’ve seen our clients kind of, [00:26:00] uh, have questions about or not do altogether that I’ve had to remind them.
I, I really love. Number one, which is really understanding the job offer and the total compensation. Um, we actually had a, another podcast episode on, uh, employee benefits that people should check out as well, because as Brandon mentioned, you know, it’s really important when you’re assessing an offer. Um, I’ve had, you know, clients where they’re so caught up on the salary, like you were saying, that they don’t even realize that when.
The total comp, they’re actually getting more than their current job, or it’s actually enough, you know, when they look at the bonus or some other areas. So, um, I definitely, definitely think that is so important. And I’m glad that you, you touch on that as well. Um, one kind of thing that I’d love to, [00:27:00] to know your, your thoughts on, and this is something that I tend to do a lot in negotiations, and I’ve recommended our clients to do is to.
If they can want, well, it’s actually two things. One, not discuss salary or ranges with that front line, that first level recruiter. So, as you know, in the, um, kind of interviewing and screening process, a lot of times people talk to that first recruiter, who’s like literally just checking check boxes, what are your salary expectations, you know, and I.
Give our clients, you know, some creative, uh, phrasing on how to try to avoid, You know, talking about numbers with that first recruiter who is not a decision maker, right? That’s not the hiring manager. Um, so that’s one thing. Um, and then, well, I’ll stop there first. What are your, what are your thoughts on that?
Brandon: No, I think that’s perfect. Um, I’m glad that you tell that to your clients cause that’s, [00:28:00] that’s the big thing too, is it’s way too early in the process. In my opinion, to share that type of information, it’s usually just a check box. They’re trying to get you in the door as well as try to understand one, what level should you fit?
And two, what should they try to get the compensation out in? Um, and honestly, like my recommendation or feedback on that, maybe you’re going there. I’m interested to hear yours. But no, you should never share your salary expectations until you get a job offer. The reason being, and what we found is usually people end up basing kind of their, um, increase or what they want in their next role based off their current role, but if they’re switching industries or they’re getting a promotion by changing, it just doesn’t make sense.
They’re going to pay night and day different. Um, so it doesn’t make sense to kind of basing off of that as well as you don’t know exactly what they’re going to pay until you ask. Um, so if you throw out a lower number than they could offer, that’s. Probably where the offer is going to end up and you’re going to end up on the low end of their pay range.
Um, especially if you throw out a number, not looking at it on like a total compensation basis. And the other [00:29:00] thing is risk is if you throw out a number, that’s too high thinking like, Hey, let’s go ahead and throw out a high number. They’ll come back with an aggressive offer. It’ll be great. I’ll get a huge raise.
Won’t even have to negotiate it. They may be like, shoot. Portia, we can’t afford you. We’re gonna go on a different route and interview and hire someone else. Um, so it’s a lot better to use like some of the snippets you recommended where you actually turn it back on the recruiter and say, Hey, to be honest, I’ve been focusing on interviewing.
So I really don’t have, um, my salary expectations in front of me and I don’t feel comfortable sharing that. However, I’d love to understand from you what your pay range is for this role. Then hopefully if you’re working with a kind recruiter, they’ll share that. Um, or you can use a few different tactics to press a little more.
Yes,
Porschia: I definitely recommend that people do that. Um, I also to what you were saying a little bit earlier, I recommend that people try to stall the number as much as possible. And, uh, Ideally, when they are getting an offer is when you’re talking to the hiring manager, [00:30:00] the person who has the budgetary authority to hire you.
Um, that is when you want to discuss numbers. So yes, I highly recommend that as well. I know sometimes that’s not always possible, but I generally try to tell our clients to stall as much as possible with a creative phrasing and yes, really understanding the job. Um, and saying that they want to understand the job before they just kind of throw out numbers and information.
Um, something else I’ve seen a lot is that people get fixated on one number as opposed to a salary range. I, and you might’ve heard this as well, but I could share some just crushing stories of people who threw out one number to a recruiter and it was, you know, 1, over. What they, the recruiter wanted to, uh, or thought was appropriate and they missed out on that whole opportunity.
Um, so I, I [00:31:00] really harp on salary ranges and some of the other steps that you said to figure out what those are, um, as opposed to 1. number. What do you think about that,
Brandon: Brandon? Yeah, I actually, I think that’s great advice. And I’m glad you’re sharing that because what it does when you share ranges, it’s actually a negotiation tactic to come off as softer, right?
You don’t necessarily know what the compensation could be just yet. You also, um, haven’t seen the job offer and you don’t want to tie yourself into one number. So when you actually share. And that’s actually one of the strategies we typically take in the counteroffer is it comes off as nicer and shows that you’re flexible.
You’re willing to work with them. It also doesn’t actually like pinhole you into one number to where you’re stuck going forward. Um, so always talking in ranges, keeping it open ended saying, Hey, look. This is, I think your range is okay. Or here’s the range I was probably thinking, but I would have to receive the job offer, review the benefits.
So I’m looking at everything holistically, and then we can talk through it to see if I have any concerns or questions for some reason. Um, [00:32:00] taking that tact is going to leave it open ended to make sure you can negotiate it once you get it and not kind of work against you when the recruiter is like, shoot, you gave me this number, we already did that.
We can’t go any higher. Or if it is above what they could offer, not even making it down the recruiting and interview process.
Porschia: Yeah, great, great. So I just shared with you two of the issues that I’ve seen clients have. I want to know from your perspective, Brandon, what are some of the biggest challenges that you’ve seen executives and professionals have with salary negotiation?
Brandon: Yeah, great question. I would say the biggest ones I see is a lot of people just don’t negotiate. Um, they find a lot of myths up in their head on kind of why they don’t negotiate. And the other one is really, um, just as you said, is the other big one. And I can’t harpoon enough is sharing salary expectations up front, um, and thinking that’s all they need to do and they’ll get the offer there is.
Um, but going to like the, the first [00:33:00] one, I don’t know. If you’ve heard a ton of myths out there, uh, but I see a lot of clients that are just up in their head. They don’t have that confidence yet because they don’t think they can negotiate everything from the employer while like, right, refuse. Um, they said they don’t negotiate to, they don’t have leverage with the job offer negotiation.
There’s a ton of different myths I could talk through that just honestly aren’t true.
Porschia: Wow. Wow. I love it. I love it. So what are some tips that you would give, I guess, outside of these great steps that you already mentioned, but what are some tips that you’d give people to help them become better salary negotiators?
Brandon: Yeah. So I guess some tips is first, um, think about entering the negotiation, right?
A lot of people are going to feel kind of concerns because you’re coming out of that excitement of getting the job offer. Like, yes, I got it. This is great. And you don’t want to jeopardize losing it. Um, but I can tell you out of all of our negotiations, we’ve [00:34:00] never seen a job offer. Rescinded. So as long as you actually follow it the right way, um, there’s really no reason why they should pull it.
You also have more leverage than you think. A lot of people think they need more offer or another offer in hand to have leverage. But at the end of the day, it’s expensive to recruit people and it takes time. You also have a recruiter that has a hiring manager that will need someone in the role. Um, so they don’t want to go back to the drawing board to hire someone else.
Usually the leverage actually shifts in the interview once you have a job offer. Um, so you do have leverage to have those conversations, but the actual tips outside of that is people are concerned of getting no as well. Um, but you’re going to get it. At different points. And it’s because if you think about the recruiters, they hire a lot of people and it’s their job to negotiate on behalf of the company.
So you need to be prepared to push back in a nice kind way to handle those, whether it’s an objection after you send a counteroffer, whether it’s pushing back when they’re pushing for your salary expectations. So for example, like [00:35:00] one of the biggest counteroffer. Nine times out of 10, the recruiter is going to come back and tell you, no, it’s what they’re trained to do because they have to show that they fought and kind of pushed back before they took the concerns back to the team and actually got a better offer.
Otherwise, they probably wouldn’t be doing their job. So a good tip that you can actually use is to handle that. See it as an objection or more so an excuse anything from like, hey, really, we gave you the best offer. We can’t move any higher. Hey, we pay everyone the same in this role. So this is the offer.
Anything like that is really should go in one ear and out the other. And a good response is to say, Hey, look, I understand that it’s a generous offer. However, I’d really like it. If you can at least take my concerns back to your team to see if they can make any adjustments. As I mentioned, I’m super excited to work at your company and I’m hoping we can start planning the transition first.
I just really appreciate if you can check one last time. Um, when you use that to handle those, essentially, you’re asking them to take it back, [00:36:00] um, getting past some of those recruiter tactics, and if they do end up taking back, nine times out of ten, they’ll come back with a better offer.
Porschia: Yeah. I love the phrasing that you, you shared right there.
Um, so tell us more about your business, the salary negotiator.
Brandon: Yeah, absolutely. Um, so we’ve been in business now for five years. Um, and the best way to kind of get in touch with us is to go to the salary negotiator. com, but we handle everything from professional one on one coaching, where we actually.
Work with everyone, um, executives to new grads, um, to entry level professionals, as well as tech professionals to actually negotiate their job offer. Um, so we actually employ our tactics acting as like a silent third party, unless you want us in the negotiation to help you actually get a better pay and make sure that you’re coming off in a good light in front of the, um, recruiting team.
And then what we also provide as well is actually salary negotiation and job offer courses. Um, [00:37:00] that way people can go ahead and learn these tips themselves. And they can tackle the negotiation themselves. But now they have the email templates, the phone scripts, compensation calculators and know how to do that.
So they don’t kind of decrease their confidence and they can feel comfortable actually going through the negotiation. Um, but people can reach out to me either on LinkedIn, um, at Brandon Bramley on LinkedIn. Uh, we also have a business page on LinkedIn, the salary negotiator, or the best thing is just going to our website and connecting with us through there, the salary negotiator.
com. Great,
Porschia: great. Well, we will be providing all of those links right to your website and to your other social channels in our show notes so that people can find you online. So I want to know, Brandon. And this is kind of our, our trademark question here at the career 101 podcast, but I want to know, how do you think executives or professionals can get a positive edge in their career?
[00:38:00] Yeah.
Brandon: So it’s kind of thinking in the salary negotiation realm, I think a good way to get an edge. Is to make sure you negotiate your job offer. Um, I used to hire a lot of people and it was for procurement vendor management roles. So if a candidate didn’t negotiate, that was like a huge red flag. Um, it’s essentially your one chance to show the hiring team that they hired the right person.
And this is how they interact with others, whether it’s an external stakeholder or an internal stakeholder. Um, so I highly recommend that you take a professional tack. You use a nice kind tone, almost like you’re talking with a friend that’s helping you feel comfortable with the move to. Um, but you don’t miss that opportunity to display your skills before you actually start the role.
Porschia: Yeah. Yeah. I think negotiation is so important and, um, I’m, I’m, I’m curious to know, Brandon, if you see this with your clients, because I’ve seen this trend with. With ours. I think a lot of the ladies have a harder time negotiating than the guys. [00:39:00] From my experience, a lot of our male clients, they don’t mind just kind of putting it out there or even applying for a job if maybe they meet like half of the requirements.
But a lot of our, uh, clients who are ladies, sometimes they don’t. They don’t feel as confident when it comes to negotiation or even applying for a job if they don’t meet every single requirement that’s in the job posting. Um, have you noticed any, any trends like that?
Brandon: Yeah, it’s, it’s funny you say that because I have seen a lot of that.
Um, honestly, I think any, anyone can negotiate a job offer and do well, but typically what happens is say when I’m negotiating a mail, um, it’s usually actually. Um, kind of talking them down because they’re sometimes a little bit too confident and want to be too aggressive and take an aggressive tack with the negotiation.
Um, but that’s really not what we coach. So it’s kind of like level setting and making sure that they look good in front of the hiring team compared to when I do work with some women, it’s actually building up that confidence. Going through the [00:40:00] steps to show, Hey, here’s the leverage you have. Here’s the research to show that they do pay more and here’s our success rate with the negotiation.
Um, and the worst case, they’re just going to say no. So it’s actually like guiding them through it a little bit more. Obviously on both scales, there’s a lot of really good negotiators out there, um, and clients that I’ve worked with. That can kind of both, but that’s typically how I’ve seen it fall. Um, but as for results, the results end up being the same, whether you’re female or male companies do pay the same.
And the most part from what I’ve seen, it’s just, who’s going to be comfortable in using guidance to actually navigate those conversations.
Porschia: Yeah. Yeah. Well, thank you so much, Brandon. You have shared a lot of, uh, I think insights and some, uh, secrets with us here today, uh, and I’m sure their listeners can use it to be more confident in their negotiations.
Uh, we appreciate you being with us.
Brandon: Thank you, Portia. I’m really happy to be here.[00:41:00]
